We interviewed Esteban Escobedo after Professional Bull Riders’ UNLEASH THE BEAST: SOCAL SHOWDOWN 2023 at Crypto Arena in downtown Los Angeles, California on Sunday, February 26th, 2023.

Hello. Would you please introduce yourself?

Hello. My name is Esteban Escobedo.

Would you please tell us where your parents are from?

My dad is from Zacatecas and my mom is from Jalisco (both states in Mexico).

And where are you from?

I was born in Burbank, California but my heart is in Mexico. It is a place I’ve always felt close to my heart. I feel passionate to continue our sport, our culture, and everything Mexico is about.

Chicano Perspectives focuses on Mexican-Americans and Chicanos. People may identify in different ways with those identities and those cultures. How would you identify?

I appreciate the question. I am a generic Mexican-American. My heart is from Mexico because of everything I get to do to keep the traditions going here in the United States.

We are here at Professional Bull Riders’ UNLEASH THE BEAST: SOCAL SHOWDOWN 2023 at Crypto Arena in downtown Los Angeles, California. It is a show Roger Martinez, his friends, and I enjoyed. We saw activists outside the arena, as was expected, related to a Los Angeles City ordinance we will be discussing later. First, we want to get to know you as a person. Please tell us about your work experience, your career development, and how you came to be where you are today.

I was born in Burbank, California. My dad was a horse farrier, which is the one who puts shoes on the horses. He did it in the Glendale and Burbank areas when I was a kid. I grew up around the Los Angeles Equestrian Center.

I grew up around horses. I was born with a deformity on my ankles. They had to adjust it, break it, and figure out how to put it back into place. A couple surgeries later, I was able to walk around two or three years old. As a kid they did not want to carry me because I was too heavy, so they would throw me on a horse. I think that is where I grew the passion for horses, for livestock, for the western culture. The lifestyle that I want to live and we are used to living. This lifestyle is not just Mexican; it is also part of the United Sates. I grew up and continued working with horses.

I went to University of California Davis and studied veterinary medicine. I worked on a degree that I created: International Agricultural Development. I tied a lot of parts of agriculture together. I continued with my passion but did not become a veterinarian. I now work for the state of California for the Department of Food and Agriculture as a livestock inspector. It has given me the opportunity to continue working with veterinarians and to continue to protect our food sources coming into California from other states and countries. We want the many live animals that come in to come in without diseases and that they are healthy. If any type of disease comes up like a pandemic, corona virus, or other diseases we see in animals, we want to eradicate those diseases as quickly as possible.

Growing up in the LA area, my dad was the manager for the Pico River Sports Arena. He did that for eighteen years. I was able to compete for Mexican rodeos, the charreadas. I was also part of the shows that were produced back in those days. These included concerts with big artists like Vicente Fernandez, Antonio Aguilar, Joan Sebastian, and Ezequiel Peña. We did a rodeo component within their concerts to keep our traditions that keep the audience interested. That is what the audiences wanted to see: the fun action, like the show here tonight.

After a while, I started riding in the rodeos for the Professional Rodeo Cowboys Association and the Professional Bull Riders, which is hosting this event. I started bull riding and bronc riding and I do a lot of roping events. These all made me want to pursuit the Mexican and American aspects of rodeo. The American rodeo comes from the Mexican rodeo back hundreds of years ago; it is something I enjoy being a part of because it is a comradery. It is a brotherhood. We are out here helping each other out as bull riders, bronc riders, and borrow each other’s horses as ropers. Everybody helps each other out. It is not a competition amongst us, but it is a competition within itself. I have always valued that and it has been great being a part of that.

Western Justice has been a part the coalition that I am part of and we are fighting the LA ordinance. I became an advisor for Western Justice and get to work with PBR (Professional Bull Riders), PRCA (Professional Rodeo Cowboys Association), and about sixty other associations that are part of our coalition. We try to educate the councilmembers and the community so they understand there is no need for this ordinance. The ordinance is misunderstood. There are a lot of myths, a lot of opinions that are not factual, and there is no support behind those. It is frustrating that this ordinance got as far as it did without us knowing about it. By the time we learned of it, they had already ran through and passed it as a motion to be able to write an ordinance. It was voted 15 to 0 by the city councilmembers. After speaking to all of them, they all confessed to us that they voted for it as a courtesy to the councilmember that wrote it (LA City Councilmember Bob Blumenfield representing district 3). It is disappointing to see that people don’t stick up for themselves and don’t stick up for their own communities. There are a lot of horse communities in the city of LA, the surroundings, and the county.

I can understand your frustration with people being uninformed. I am uninformed about the ordinance you reference. I am working to better understand it. Would you tell us about the animals involved with Professional Bull Riders?

You mainly see bulls. There are a few horses because there is always someone on horseback if they need to rope one of the bulls. There are always two or three horses and sometimes more. Horses may get tired and get switched out so they don’t overwork themselves. The bulls are athletes. They are athletes just like us. We train in the gym as many times a day as we need to prepare our bodies and prepare our mind to be able to get on the back of the bull. You are getting on the back of a 2,000 pound animal. They are as strong as can be; it is like Samson against Goliath. It is a huge adrenaline rush and something that we have always enjoyed. The animals are treated better than most people treat their own pets in their backyard. These bulls because they are athletes have a specific diet. A lot of these bulls get to live long lives. Most of the time they live 7, 9, 10 or up to 11 or 12 years within the sport.

If you really think about it, and most people don’t pay attention to this: it is only 8 seconds per bull ride. You would be surprised how few minutes these bulls work per year. I’ve asked plenty people the question and they don’t know how to answer it. It is about 7 minutes a year that they work and they have the best facilities, including the ground where they sleep on, the food they get to eat, and the water they get to drink. Because they are athletes, they get trained. They go through physical therapy and massage therapy. You can’t treat them any better.

And these are American Bucking Bulls? Is that accurate?

The same bulls are used in most of the events, including charreadas. We (charreadas) use them a little bit smaller (than Professional Bull Riders) because charreadas riders are not at the same level as the Professional Bull Riders you see here. These guys (PBR) are fit and trained because they ride every weekend, three or four times a weekend. They may ride 10 bulls during the week just to practice. For us (charreadas), it is a lot of young kids. They ride because they love it. We try to teach them the right way. They get out of work and want to go practice. So, they may only get on 1 or 2 bulls a month.

For us, what distinction are you referencing?

Charreadas. I mean when you asked about Mexican and American bulls. The bulls themselves are all the same.

I am sorry. I was referencing the bulls used in PBR.

Well you were asking about American bulls so I am trying to distinguish here. The ones here at PBR, stock contractors bring them from all over the country. We might get bulls from Oklahoma. We might get bulls from Montana or Wyoming. It is like the riders (who come from different places). They bring different animals for every circuit.

Because the bulls are also competing within the sport, every time they ride out, there is a score that is as high as 50 points possible for the bull and 50 points possible for the rider. That would be 100 points total. We have never seen that score. But last year, we had a 98.75 which is the highest marked ride in PBR history. The bull and the rider did so well that they almost scored perfect. So, every time you see a score if it is 85 or 86 or whatever it may be, half is for the bull and half is for the rider.

Ah, Ok.

The rider may have dominated the bull a little bit more so they score the riders’ points a little bit more than the bull, or it can be the other way around. When the bulls knock the riders down or they buck really strong, their scores go higher. Those scores accumulate every year. I think they pick the top 8 scores of each bull to be the world championship bulls. They compete like the riders. There are a lot of good bulls.

During the first couple of rounds you see some local bulls and some other ones coming from out of state. By the time you get to the championship round, which we just watched right now, you get the top 15 bulls of the whole circuit. They compete just like we do.

Would you describe a typical day for a PBR bull, including how they are transported?

Sure, here in LA it is a little different because we don’t a big parking lot to set up back pens, or a stock yard, or a feed lot. There we could put the bulls into pens that have dirt, where they can walk around a little bit more. Here they are after they are unloaded, we place them in back pens. The pens are behind the chutes where they are coming out when they perform. They are penned in a single file line; each one gets moved over from one corral to another corral until they go to perform. When they are done, they go back out the chute and are put back in the group of bulls that they came with. They then go back in the trailer so they can go back home.

At night, the bulls usually stay at a local ranch that the stock contractor knows or a facility that is available where they can keep them overnight. That way they can get out and rest, roll over, get dirty again, and do their own thing. They want to have a peaceful night. They get their meals. There is a specific diet each bull has. Every bull gets their separate plate for their tub of feed. If they need to be massaged, there is an apparatus they put on their backs to relax them. If you walk through these pens, especially when it is their down time, they are as gentle as dogs. The little kids of the stock contractors will go up to these bulls and pet them. The bulls know them. Even as big and as strong as they look, they are animals that care, they have a heart, and they want to be there. They are there to work. It is what they want to do.

Marcelo Procopio Pereira by Roger Martinez

You have already discussed their lifespan and a typical day for them. So, leaving LA, do you know where they are going?

Most of the bulls go back home or they go to the next tour. Every weekend they have something going on from here until May for the world finals. They then take a break and bring back the bulls when they start the teams’ competition; it is part of a new PBR league they started last year.

You may have heard the announcer discuss statistics. There is always statistics. For example, one of the riders may have ridden a certain bull two or three times in the past. Maybe he stayed on, maybe he didn’t, but every out is different. We never know. We could ride the bull 100 times over and I may never stay on or I may never fall off.

They feel us on their back. They know exactly where we are at. Their job is to get us off. That’s it. Unfortunately, sometimes we fall the wrong way or we don’t know how to jump off the right way and they’ll step on us and some of the guys get hurt. But, it’s part of it. We’ve always said, “You never know when you are going to get hurt, it is just a matter of when and how bad.”

Yes, there were a couple close calls earlier today. The riders looked to be okay; some looked more seriously injured than others. But this is part of the sport right?

It is. You look at football and some of the other sports and there are a lot of collisions. We always say, “We are bred differently.” Our riders, we just withstand a little bit more pain or we just know how to get through it to be able to ride the next day. We have really good medical staff that takes care of everybody and does exactly what they need to do and make the decisions. If we are not fit to ride they are going to tell us.

I read that each bull is only ridden once per day. Is that accurate or are they ridden multiple times?

That is accurate. The reason we do that is because that is what they are here for. They produce and they perform. As you saw, when a judge throws the red flag, there is a re-ride. That bull that ran when the flag was thrown is not put back in to be ridden again. They bring in a different bull. They have so many bulls that they bring in as backups that if a rerun is needed they put those backups in to replace the bull. So, no, we don’t put the same bull in twice because they are here for their 8 seconds and that is it.

So, in a day, the most they will be bucking is the 8 seconds and they may buck a little more as they are being put back into the chute. But generally, a few minutes and they are back in the pen right?

Yes, exactly.

I want to move our conversation towards discussion of the ordinance. Would you tell more of your connection with the LA community given that it is an LA ordinance?

Because I grew up in this area and the events we have done in the past, I have gotten to know a lot of people. We have always considered Los Angeles as the home base for all of us, maybe not as much the rodeo because they travel all over the country. I look back in our Mexican culture when Antonio Aguilar first came to do his performances in the late 60s and early 70s. He always liked coming to LA to finish the shows or start the season. It is huge. That is why his statue is in La Plazita Olvera and recently they put the Vicente Fernandez statue in one of the parks. These are big names that always came to Los Angeles because it is what we identify ourselves with. These artists focus on LA because there are a lot of Hispanics here. With LA being the second largest city in the United States, it is huge for all of us. Hollywood is here. There are a lot of opportunities and the crowd has always been very supportive with what we’ve done. You see it. There are a lot of constituents that come in. I’ve seen people come in from San Diego and from up north. They come anytime something is here because it is a type of venue you don’t get to see on a regular basis. Some of the other venues in the rest of the state are a lot smaller. This is the biggest site that we have events at, which is why a lot of people enjoy coming here.

You are referring to Crypto Arena?

Correct.

I agree with you because I saw the support of the crowd. You can’t be sure of where people are from just by looking at them. However, a lot of the people here seemed to me to be Hispanic. Roger had friends from the Mexican community. They were in a suite enjoying the show. This event is definitely supported by the Mexican-American community. And the Antonio Aguilar statue you referenced is of him on a horse. Correct?

Correct.

It seems the LA City Council may be taking away the careers, enjoyment, and hobbies of people interested in this part of our culture.

Correct.

With that being said, would you explain your understanding of the proposed ordinance?

With the proposed ordinance, Councilmember Blumenfield wants to, according to him, ban allegedly torturous devices that we use in the rodeo. The devices he claims are torturous devices that he describes in the ordinance are electric prods, tie-downs that are made of wire, flank straps, and any spur that is modified, fixed, or sharp. Flank straps are the ropes you saw around the bull on the back on the flank, they are similar to you wearing a belt. I’ll explain all these with more detail later; I am giving a generalized review. And last December, they added lassos and lariats.

The problem with the ordinance is that the way it is written it is very vague. There is no description why the equipment is considered torturous devices. We found out that in the last city council meeting in December, the city attorney did not even know why some of these events are being banned. He does not even know if we use ropes or not. It shows, and I hate to say this, but it is the honest truth about the ignorance that they have, that they are not even paying attention to the equipment. They don’t know what the equipment is.

Every time we have tried to talk to the councilman’s office, it is always, “Well, this is what we have been told.” We found out Last Chance for Animals has been supportive of Blumenfield’s office to try to pass this ordinance. They are extreme activists that want nobody to own any pet, ever, anywhere in the United States. That is their main goal. We all know that is never going to happen and they know that is never going to happen. But, they pick on us because they think we are abusing the animals. They think we are forcing the animals to buck or that we are putting the flank straps on them to make them buck.

I will start with that piece of equipment. On the bulls, we place a cotton rope that is about 5/8s of an inch thick. It has a ring at the end that we tie a loose slip-knot on. A slip-knot is designed that when you pull a rope it is going to fall off. It is just loose enough. It is like when we wear a belt or a little child wears a harness when you are walking them at Disneyland or like a dog that is wearing a collar. It doesn’t hurt the animal. There is the myth that it is tied around their genitals, which is not true. But again, they don’t have any facts that support that they (flank straps) are dangerous or that they are injuring these animals.

The flank straps that we use on the bucking horses are a thick piece of leather that is about three inches wide but it is covered with fleece that comes off of the sheep. The whole thing is covered so it doesn’t injure them. It is soft as can be. I would love to have a belt with that because it feels comfortable and it is not going to hurt the horse. We pull it just like a belt and there is a quick latch that makes it come right off; it comes off so they stop bucking. These are cues so the animals know exactly how to buck, to buck forward. Even if the bulls are spinning, they are controlled because if they don’t have it (flank strap) that animal can flip over on the rider. So, they would injure themselves and the rider; that is what we try to avoid. These bulls are trained.

A lot of people think that they only buck with that flank strap and that is not true. They are bred for that. That is what these bulls are trained for. If there are bulls that don’t want to buck day in and day out, then they are not going to participate in the rodeo. It is as easy as that. But the ones that do and are consistent, they make a lot of money. Like this event, how much money is made in the unions? How much money is paid to all the employees that get to work here in LA? How much tax revenue comes in because people come in from out of the state or out of the country or even out of the area? It is something that the councilmember keeps ignoring. There is a lot of value because we bring a lot of support from the communities that want to see this here in LA. I think the problem we keep having and why we keep butting our head against the wall is that a lot of folks don’t know that this is going on. They don’t know that this ordinance is getting ready to be passed.

Moving to the other items, in our cultures of Mexican and American rodeo we have never seen a wire tie-down. We don’t even know why that came into play or why that was added to the ordinance. If they want to pass that, that is fine because we don’t use a bare wire tie-down. A tie-down is a leather strap that is around the nose of the horse to guide him so they are focused on where they are walking. You don’t want a horse with their heads up really high because then they don’t see where they are putting their feet. You want to control them so they know where they are walking so they don’t trip and hurt themselves or hurt us when we are riding them. Again, no one is going to try to injure their own horses. These animals cost us a lot of money. Any bulls that are here could cost anywhere from $15,000 to $20,000 to $300,000 to $400,000.

Oh wow!

The animals are not something to mess with just to try something or hurt them. There is no reason for that. Continuing on to what they bring up with the electric prods. We don’t use electric prods. They warn the animals and the feeling is like when you rub your feet against the floor on carpet to get static electricity. It is battery operated and it is usually C batteries. We have tased ourselves on accident and even do it on purpose. It just gives you a zap but it doesn’t hurt. A bull’s hide is about is about 7 or 8 times as thick as ours, a horse’s is probably 3 or 4 times as thick as ours. So, when you tap them with that they know they have to move forward. The only time those are ever used in a rodeo is for safety: if an animal goes down and we have to help it get up or if an animal just doesn’t want to move, especially a 2,000 pound bull. We have to able to get it to move somehow. Most of the time, I’ll just zap against the metal pole and not them. They hear the noise and they know they have to move forward. So, we don’t use that as often. We already have the California state penal code. I think it is 596.7 and it states how to use that electric prod within the state and within rodeos. That penal code has a definition of rodeos as three or more events (bareback bronc riding, saddle bronc riding, bull riding, calf roping, steer wrestling, or team roping).

In that penal code, along with regulating that hot-shot, California also requires rodeos to have a veterinarian on-site or on-call to attend to injured animals. In the very rare case if there were an injury, they have to go to the California Veterinarian Medical Board to present any injuries that they had to tend to. All of the vets that work with us are very offended by this ordinance because they are disrespecting their work as medical professionals because they are saying that they are not doing their job. I don’t know the exact numbers right now, but I think it is a 0.004 % chance that an animal is going to get injured at a rodeo. Because I work for the state of California, I went a little bit further and spoke to some of Los Angeles’ animal control officers that I have gotten to work with here at this facility and at other places. I asked for a ten-year report for any injuries in the city of Los Angeles during a rodeo. They gave me a report and there wasn’t any. There was only one in Lakeview Terrace from a local rodeo. It was a steer that got scratched. It wasn’t anything bad but because the veterinarian tended to it, they had to report it. That is one injury in ten years.

Because we tend to them so much, and love these animals, an injury is the last thing we want. Obviously, there are freak accidents. We can be walking down a sidewalk and slip and fall and hurt ourselves. These animals can be walking into the trailer and slip and fall and hurt themselves. We know there is always a possibility. We do not pursuit to injure the animals purposely. When they report this equipment that they describe as torturous devices, there is no reason to bring that up. How is it torturous devices? Again, we have asked the councilmembers to explain to us, “Where are your statistics? Where are your facts?”

Okay.

The only facts they have brought to us were things that they heard back in the 70s from a veterinarian that is already dead. How does that focus on today’s times? Maybe in the past things weren’t done correctly. Not everybody in the backyard of their home is going to do things the right way. We know that. But when we do something that is organized, something that is sanctioned, something that is official for us, we make sure that in the American rodeo we have regulations. We have certain rules we have to follow. Anybody that does not follow those rules is either suspended indefinitely or they are fined. Sometimes, they don’t do it purposely and it might be an accident, but even then we protect the animals to the extreme. So if we want to talk about activism, I think we are more active than some of these other folks because we want to make sure those animals have the welfare, the care, the nutrition, and the best life they can to be able to perform at the elite level that we need them to, just like we do as riders.

In your discussions with LA city representatives and councilmembers, are there any reports that they reference?

There is none. It is all myths and opinions. The only thing that we’ve heard from their offices or from Blumenfield’s office for district 3 is that they get tens of thousands of calls, this is quoted by him, on a regular basis. He says, “People are just complaining that we need to get rid of rodeos in the city of LA.” First of all, our lobbyists and a lot of folks have said that there is no way that he is going to receive that many calls in a day.

That does sound like a lot of calls.

What he is referring to is that there is a Change.org petition that they (ordinance supporters) produced and there is one we produced (ordinance opposition). Let’s compare the two. They produced one almost six years ago and they are up to about 24,000 signatures. We started ours two years ago and we are close to 37,000 signatures. If you compare the two, then we have a bigger advantage because we have more signatures and done it in less time.

Yes, it seems so.

You can send an e-mail to the LA city clerk on your opposition or support for the ordinance. We are up about 65% to 35% on the amount of comments. What is disappointing to me is that we offered an English and Spanish letter to the councilmember. I do most of the Spanish translation for us. So, all these activists started using my own Spanish words from that letter against us to fight against the ordinance and back their side. I saw it was my own words because if you use Google translate, the words for the equipment don’t translate well. A lot of people don’t know that or how to pronounce the name of the equipment. So, people didn’t know the equipment being described in the ordinance and just let it go. Now that we are specifying exactly what the equipment is and what it is called (in Spanish), people know what they are after.

For example, banning spurs is a big problem for us because we wear spurs for everything. We use them to ride our horses, for trail riding, for shows, for jumping horses, for the Olympics. They want to ban their use, yet they are focusing only on rodeo. They want to allow the Olympics to continue with their spurs, but their spurs are fixed and modified because it is basically a straight bar with a nub at the end. Ours rotate, ours have to rotate, and they are dull, they are not sharp. Again, we don’t want to injure our animals. That is the last thing we want.

I feel discriminated and it is more of a racist thing because they are trying to take our rights. These rodeos are our first amendment rights to celebrate our own culture and celebrate our beliefs. It is wrong for them to specify that rodeo has to be banned but they are going to allow everyone else to do their thing, all the other equestrian disciplines. I don’t think that is fair and that is something we are trying to clarify with them. Because new councilmembers are coming in, we are trying to talk to their officers. A lot of them have heard us. Councilmember Monica Rodriguez and her staffers are really working hard and helping us out because her district is all equestrian supporters, all horses. They are really trying to push to change the wording on the ordinance to benefit both parties. That is fine if they are trying to ban certain things we don’t use. We don’t use sharp spurs.

Yes.

We don’t use wire tie-downs. If they want to get rid of that, go ahead. But in the proposed ordinance they define every single event of the rodeo so they are attacking just us.

It seems they are taking events that are in rodeo and transferring that into the ordinance as opposed to taking equestrian and ranch activities and being general. It seems it is more targeted to rodeo culture that has historically been linked with Mexican-American culture. Is this what you are referring to when you describe it as discrimination?

Yes, because as a charro, as a Mexican cowboy, we still practice a lot of the old ranch-style practices or events that we used to do on the open range or the ranches. That is what our sport is about. We have a cultural patrimony in Mexico that they recognize as a cultural tradition that needs to stay. If that is the culture that introduced rodeo, rodeo should have the same patrimony here in the United States. We always consider baseball as America’s pastime, but in reality, in America’s history, rodeo is the national sport. It has been around for hundreds of years. So, for them to try to attack it is disappointing.

Because they are only going after the rodeo, we are trying to figure out why. Why is it okay for other equestrians to do their thing but we are being attacked? And we have not gotten an answer; they won’t explain that to us.

That leads me to my next question. You feel you have not received an adequate response?

No, recently La Opinion reached out to me. They published an article last year after speaking to both parties. It was not one sided and she did a really good job explaining. Because the equipment wasn’t translated correctly, a lot of people did not understand the article itself. I know the city councilmembers didn’t really pay attention to it. She reached out to me again a couple weeks ago. Now that the opposition sees how much we are pushing, getting people to understand, and getting the traction from people that are supportive, the opposition wanted to try to produce an article for people that would explain their side. She didn’t want to have it. She called me and said, “Look, I want to hear your side. It has been two years. What is going on with this ordinance?” She called their office and they ignored her. That shows you the city councilmembers are just being ignorant. You can’t take something from someone without giving a specific reason. That is where we are at right now.

If they would have talked to us from the very beginning, we would have bargained and coordinated with them. We are still willing to make amendments with them.

I haven’t brought this up but it is very important, Los Angeles Equestrian Advisory Committee is a committee made up of all 15 districts and each councilmember appoints someone that they think is an expert in the equestrian community. This committee includes a veterinarian; he is the president, and other associates that are part of the communities involved with horses. They wrote up a lot of amendments and they gave them to the councilmember. They are not even being heard.

When I talked to the animal control officers, they are upset because they are the ones who are going to regulate this stuff and they don’t even know why. They say, “We don’t agree with them.” So, we are hoping we can get a vote that is actually voted and is not unanimous. The PAAW Committee met in December and focused on animal rights and animal welfare. They voted in support of the ordinance. There was no opposition at all. These folks don’t understand this, they don’t care. We have been trying to work with them for two years. We talked to representatives of all 15 districts last year. We are trying to talk to the new councilmembers that are in there now. They are listening but I don’t know why they feel afraid that they can’t speak up. That is what is disappointing. Why can one person dominate the whole council on something so, I don’t even know what word to put.

It is sad to see an ordinance like this knowing the history of the one they are trying to mimic. The ordinance started in 1992 in the city of Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. They passed it there. Now Pittsburgh wants the PBR back so they are trying to figure out how to abolish it. Why are we trying to adopt it here?

One of the other pieces of equipment that we have not talked about is the lasso and lariats. Listing those tools is where I felt discriminated because I am a trick roper. At this PBR event last year, I got to do trick roping during the opening presentation. I performed right after the national anthem. We brought all the charros in from all over the country to represent. The performance finally gave us an opportunity to expose our sport to the crowds and it was received very well. Roping is an essential piece of a lot of the events that are done in rodeo. I am referring to rodeo in general not just bull riding.

Esteban Escobedo performing at Professional Bull Riders’ UNLEASH THE BEAST: SOCAL SHOWDOWN 2022 by Professional Bull Riders

I understand.

In bull riding, if you have to rope a bull when it is acting up or you have to do something to get him out of the arena, what else are you going to use? Back in the early 1500s, Spaniards tried to teach us a different way of working cattle and moving them. It wasn’t very humane. Consequently, in Mexico the ropes were created. Roping a horse, cow, steer, or bull is the safest way to move them around. Ropes don’t hurt the animals. It is another training piece of equipment that we use to train them how to move when we need them to. This is a piece of equipment that is very necessary. It is not only necesssary in the American rodeo, but in the Mexican rodeo as well. 5 out of the 10 events that we do in rodeo, we use the rope.

I work with trick roping. I teach kids how to trick rope starting as young as 3 and up to adults. Many of the parents and folks I get to work with are upset because they want to continue the tradition. They see how the kids value that piece of equipment that I use to teach them. Trick roping is a different skill that keeps them busy. They are not on video games all the time. They are not watching television all the time. Parents will send me videos where their kid is out in the backyard for hours trying to figure out a trick that I asked them to do. I see that they are valuing our culture and their own culture; they are valuing themselves. They are representing themselves as who they are. I have an American student and one that is Korean. They are not Mexican, but that does not mean that they cannot do what we do. We see a lot of American trick ropers, guys and girls. I have a lot of little girls I am teaching. I am proud of them and proud that they want to continue our traditions. Why strip the next generation of a sport that is so beautiful, that brings people together? Why mess with the PBR brotherhood that we have where everybody rides together, including riders or and charro? It is a family event. Where else can you go and compete with your father, your grandfather, your son, aunts, and uncles? We bring everybody together.

I definitely felt the sense of community here interacting with people at PBR Los Angeles. You discussed wanting to have a conversation with officials and finding that difficult. Are there parts of the ordinance that you can support, you think are important, or that are salvageable?

They obviously want to pass something. We get that. We’d like to get rid of the whole thing just because it doesn’t make sense. But, we are willing to make amendments that fix it for all the parties to be happy. The sharp spurs are something we don’t use. Wire tie-downs are something we do not use. If they want to ban those, that is fine. Why they keep going after the rest of the equipment is what we don’t understand. There is nothing in our rule books that allows any animal to be injured by any of those pieces of equipment. Again, they are training tools. They are cues to get the animals to perform the way they are supposed to. It is not to affect them. People they think that those flank straps are tied around the genitals. That is a myth. We’ve never seen that. There is so many pictures that we’ve produced to them showing where it is tied, near the waist area, near the flanks, and it is way above where the genitals are. Female horses don’t have that, so how do they keep expressing the same thing over and over again? They don’t understand!

We are willing to work with them. The problem is that we are not being heard. We are being heard by other councilmembers but not the one that wrote the ordinance himself: Councilmember Blumenfield. We tried to reach out to his office but he doesn’t want to talk to us. What is frustrating is that his claims have always been, “I don’t want to affect rodeo. I am not trying to ban rodeo. I am not trying to ban the charros. I am not trying to ban their sport.” He just wants to ban the allegedly torturous devices. We tried to explain to them that we cannot do the sport without those pieces of equipment. It seems like it just goes one ear and comes out of the other because he keeps saying, “Well, I am not trying to affect rodeo.” Well, if he is not trying to affect rodeo, why is he trying to ban these specific equipment? It is not that we are trying to be stubborn; it is that they are necessary for us to do what we need to do. And again, the veterinarians, the medical doctors for animals, use a hot-shot to get an animal up if they are down. They are pieces of equipment for medical purposes. It is for the safety of these animals. It is safety equipment. They are not torturous devices. Again, I don’t know where they get their facts from. I don’t know where they’ve seen some of these things. I personally sent a seven page letter when I sent my comment in to the city council office and I sent it to all the councilmembers. A few of them replied that they’ll get back to me. I never heard from them. I specified that I’d invited them any day they want to take them out on the ranch so they know how to use this equipment and use it properly. I want to teach them what it is to work with animals. Nobody has taken me up on that.

It is frustrating to know that people are going to vote on something that they don’t even understand. They aren’t even willing to listen.

Dalton Kasel wins UNLEASH THE BEAST: SOCAL SHOWDOWN 2023 by Roger Martinez

I thank you because that really summarized your position and who you are working with and trying to work with. You feel there have not been productive discussions and you have not had the opportunity to have a dialogue with them. Correct?

I think the hard part is that we understand they are busy. There are so many problems with the homeless; there are so many issues with other parts of the city. They have a lot of other things that they need to focus on and worry about. This is always pending and they just need to get rid of it or actually do it. We were told on January 10th, 2023 that they were going to meet to discuss it but that didn’t happen. We are already at the end of February and they don’t know if it is going to be next week or the week after. We keep trying to talk to them, work with their lawyers, and work with their lobbyist to get that communication going. We are hopeful. Luckily, a lot of the staffers that are working for some of the councilmembers were with other councilmembers in the past and they’ve heard us before. They get it. They understand our position better and better able to explain it to the councilmembers.

Okay.

But, we never know if that actually happens. We can send as many documents as we can to them but we don’t know if they actually sit down and read them.

That brings me to my next question. Where is that ordinance at now? It seems you are not sure.

Nobody knows! Every time we speak to a different councilmembers’ office, that is the first thing they ask us, “When is it going to be presented?” Well, if we don’t know, and you don’t know, who is going to figure it out? We look it up every week to see if it is going to be brought up or not. Our lobbyists dedicate a lot of time to make sure we know about it. I’ve asked them to let us know. They claim that they are going to let us know but we still haven’t heard when it is going to be brought into council meeting or when it is going to be on the agenda so they can actually talk about it.

Because we are guests here at PBR, I want to add that I enjoyed the experience. For people who share your position. How can they support you? What would you ask of those in the LA community that want to continue to see public rodeo events?

There are three things we have been working on. The main thing is to leave a comment onLaCityClerk.org. That is what the city councilmembers are going to look at. We can leave a comment on that website. It is very easy. But, we found a problem because people don’t understand that after you leave a comment against the ordinance, you are sent an email to confirm it is your comment. If you don’t verify that confirm email, the message doesn’t get counted. We think there are thousands of messages that still haven’t been counted because people did not know how to do them appropriately. We didn’t learn of this until we asked the city attorney to explain it to us. They are not being fair in that sense.

When they had this last meeting, the only people that spoke are the people that are for the ordinance. We didn’t get to speak. And they won’t listen to anyone else but themselves. So, how are we supposed to get them to understand that this is unnecessary if they won’t listen to us? Another thing that we are asking people to do is to sign the Save the Rodeo petition at change.org.

The petition will help, but the main thing is the city clerk comment. Finally, we are supportive of Western Justice which is a non-profit organization that is running our coalition. We all work together but they are the main focus. They have memberships. Supporters can become members for $50 or $100 or $250 or $500 or $1,000. That would support the western way the western lifestyle and the agricultural life that we live. The money is used to pay for the lobbyists and legal fees. They also sponsor different events. But right now, we are trying to focus on defeating this ordinance. We are already prepared to sue the city if the ordinance gets passed. But, we are hoping we can work with them to avoid that. If it passes, we are prepared legally and have a memorandum to protect us because it is history. Rodeo is an American sport that we have been doing for many years and we want to continue doing it because we see the twinkle in the kids’ eyes when they participate. They want to continue it. They want to keep riding their horses and learning how to ride the bulls. It is amazing to see that many different organizations created different groups of kids that want to continue the sport. The PBR has been very supportive with some of these kids. A couple of them came last year when we had our call to action. It is nice to see how excited these kids get when they see the bull riders.

I would like to thank you for your time and for the information you provided us. Is there anything you wanted to add or anything we didn’t ask about but could have?

I hope that whoever reads what you put supports us, comments on the city clerk page, and signs the petition to make their voices heard. We are here in the United States so we should be allowed to do that. If we don’t do it, it is because we don’t want to. I think we have that capability to defeat the ordinance; we just need to push the information and let people know. If they want more information, we are more than happy to help out. We want to make sure people understand that this is what is going on in the city of LA and there is going to be repercussions. Whatever happens in California and Los Angeles trickles on to other parts of the United States. We don’t want to see the whole country fall apart as they start banning rodeos everywhere. That is the last thing we need because we want to keep producing entertainment for the fans. They are not focusing on that. Thank you for your time.

Thank you. Thank you very much!

https://cityclerk.lacity.org/lacityclerkconnect/index.cfm?fa=ccfi.viewrecord&cfnumber=20-1575

https://www.change.org/p/la-city-council-save-rodeo-in-los-angeles

https://www.westernjustice.info/